[Sidefx-houdini-list] Autodesk bought Softimage

Ben Schrijvers ben.schrijvers at guerrilla-games.com
Mon Oct 27 05:40:02 EDT 2008


I would have really appreciated if they would have mentioned those 
paralles with Houdini themselves.
Just be open about things and tell it like it is. A bit like you do now 
Andy...
Now I don't have any pitty for them.
Although I must admit this is really sad for a lot of people who got 
really enthosiastic.
If XSI will have the same destiny as Maya they they are practically dead 
now.


Andy Nicholas wrote:
> Totally agree, but I don't think they're trying to become Houdini. I also
> think that even if they were, it'd take them a lot longer than you
> mentioned to get anywhere near Houdini.
>
> As far as I'm concerned, they're just adding features that the XSI
> community have been asking for for a long time, it just so happens that
> they realise the power of a nodal system. Its unsurprising that parallels
> are going to be drawn between Houdini and XSI, but I don't think it's a
> worthwhile comparison. I've always felt that they're intended for two
> different markets (although I think SideFX is trying to widen that now).
>
> A
>
>
>   
>> You can use a Group Sop to get points that are inside a mesh and it's
>> fast.
>>
>> I haven't played with Ice but from what I've heard what has been done is
>> great but apart of particles and the equivalent of Vop to deform
>> geometry, what else do they have. I really feel they won't reach the
>> level of Houdini 9.5 before at least 3-4 years.
>>
>> François
>>
>> Andy Nicholas wrote:
>>     
>>>> SoftImage's innovation on ICE is their marketing,
>>>>
>>>>         
>>> Have you used it though Ammon? I think you'll find that it's not just a
>>> pretty, well marketed particle system. It's incredibly fast, and by
>>> that,
>>> I mean faster than Houdini. This opens up doors to visualising and
>>> achieving effects that previously couldn't be done without a lot of
>>> extra
>>> time, effort, and planning.
>>>
>>> I don't want this to sound like I'm dissing Houdini and just trying to
>>> promote ICE, but the reality of production focusses one's attention very
>>> quickly onto what the best tool is for the job. I've frequently found
>>> myself doing things in ICE that I'd never consider doing in Houdini,
>>> usually down to computational speed, but also due to the way that the
>>> workflow in ICE makes it extremely quick to test things out, and it
>>> allows
>>> you to work at a high level rather than getting lost in the details.
>>>
>>> For example, a simple node such as "Point in volume" just returns a true
>>> or false based on a point posiiton, but it's so incredibly handy that I
>>> use it all the time. I'm sure I could use a Ray SOP to do something
>>> similar, but it's all about convenience. ICE is very convenient when it
>>> comes to this sort of thing.
>>>
>>> When people talk about innovation, I think this can apply in lots of
>>> different areas. It doesn't have to be some new algorithm to achieve a
>>> specific effect, I think it can also be in introducing a new standard
>>> and
>>> ease of workflow. If you've used ICE in production, then you'll know
>>> that
>>> Softimage has done exactly that.
>>>
>>> I guess I just don't particularly like to hear people knocking something
>>> when they haven't seen the sort of positive affect it's had. The guys at
>>> Softimage put a lot of work into it and have completely changed the way
>>> that we work with effects.
>>>
>>> All this pro-ICE stuff aside, for the job I'm doing at the moment I'd
>>> never consider using any other package than Houdini. In terms of the
>>> level
>>> of control it gives you to manipulate simulations from sources like
>>> Realflow for example, it's incredible. I have no doubt that without
>>> Houdini my current job wouldn't be feasible.
>>>
>>> I guess what I'm trying to say is that I think it's a mistake to invest
>>> yourself so heavily in one package or tool, it pays to be flexible and
>>> to
>>> examine other possibilities. Dismissing ICE as nothing new because it
>>> has
>>> similarities to VEX and VOPs is only limiting your choices, and I can't
>>> see a good reason for doing that.
>>>
>>> Cheers!
>>>
>>> Andy
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>       
>>>> On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 3:13 AM, Dragos Stefan <ds_list at dsg.ro> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>         
>>>>> I totally agree about Houdini's help. I don't think however that
>>>>> Softimage's support compares with SESI's. And when it comes to ICE,
>>>>> well, in my opinion it took far too long for them to come out with it,
>>>>> and when they did it showed up there was really no innovation as they
>>>>> just copied what SESI did with VEX/VOPs many years ago.
>>>>>
>>>>>           
>>>> SoftImage's innovation on ICE is their marketing, just like it was
>>>> when SoftImage
>>>> introduced the "world's first"(*) animation software with non-linear
>>>> animation.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Ammon
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>>>>         
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>>>       
>>     
>
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